God the son – Messiah For All

How Many Persons Created the Heavens and the Earth?

February 23, 2015Guestspeaker23 Comments

It is commonly believed that the One who speaks as the Creator of all things in Isaiah chapters 44 and 45 is the triune God consisting of three Persons. The language of Isaiah 44:24 cannot possibly be reconciled with the popular idea:

“Thus says the Lord (Yahweh) your Redeemer who formed you from the womb: ‘I am the Lord who made all things, who stretched out the heavens alone, who spread out the earth. Who was with me?’” (RV)

The implied answer is, of course, that no one was present with the one Lord in the act of creation. Yahweh stretched out the heavens alone. The Hebrew word rendered “alone” means “in a state of separation, by one’s self” (Brown, Driver and Briggs, Lexicon of the Old Testament, p. 94). No one assisted God, the Father at the creation. Moreover, the Creator is one Person, not three:

“Have we not all one Father? Has not one God created us?” (Malachi 2:10).

Nowhere does the Old Testament speak of a Trinity of Persons in the Godhead.

Elsewhere in the Old Testament it is said:

“You, God, even You alone, You have made the heaven…the earth and all things” (2 Kings 19:15).

“You are the Lord, even You alone; You have made the heaven, the earth and all things” (Nehemia 9:6).

The Lord God is always distinguished from the promised Messiah. They are never said to be members of one Godhead.

English: a Venn diagram-like symbol for the Ch... — Venn diagram-like symbol for the Christian Trinity (God the Father, God the Son, and the Holy Spirit) a so called monotheism but having a triune god (Photo credit: Wikipedia)

This simple information should prevent us from ever believing that Jesus, the Messiah, the Son of God, was present with the Father when the latter created the heavens and the earth. The idea that Jesus actually created the heavens and earth of Genesis 1:1 has been promoted by the Worldwide Church of God. Their teaching was that there are two members in the one “God-family.” Isaiah 44:24 (cited above) clearly states that ONE person alone created the heavens and the earth. Language has no way of expressing this more distinctly.

Trinitarians hold that the second member of the triune God was instrumental in the creation of Genesis 1:1. This, however, contradicts the statement that the one Creator was the Father (Malachi 2:10, cited above).

When Jesus came into being at his birth he enjoyed a unique communion with his Father. Thus he says,

“I am not alone, because the Father is with me” (John 16:32).

Jesus always speaks as a person distinct from his Father, exactly as every son is an individual separate from his father. The personal “I” of the New Testament never refers to the Father and Son together. So also in the Old Testament the personal “I” refers to one Person, not three.

Jesus prays that the disciples may be

“one even as we [the Father and I] are one” (John 17:11).

This is a unity of purpose and will. Jesus prays also:

“May they [the disciples] all be one as You, Father, are in me and I in You, so that they may also be in us” (John 17:21).

It is obvious from these texts that the Father and Son use the ordinary personal pronouns to distinguish themselves as any father and son would. It is thus beyond question that Jesus was not with the Father when the latter described His act of creation:

“Thus says the Lord [Yahweh], your Redeemer…I am the Lord who made all things, who stretched out the heavens by myself…Who was with me?” (Isaiah 44:24).

Jesus did not exist as a person when the Lord God created all things. God, the Father, was alone responsible for the creation of the universe. (The “us” of Genesis 1:26, in connection with the creation of man, probably refers to attendant angels, cp. Job 38:7.) Most believers in the Trinity no longer use Genesis 1:26 as a proof of the triune God.

Jesus came into being as the Son of God when Mary conceived him supernaturally. Luke is careful to tell us that it was because of the miraculous conception in Mary’s womb, not because of any so-called “eternal generation,” that Jesus was the Son of God:

“Holy Spirit will come upon you [Mary] and the power of the Most High will overshadow you, and for that reason the child conceived will be holy, the Son of God” (Luke 1:35).

If God, the Father (the Lord, Yahweh of the Old Testament) was alone the author of the creation, why does the belief that Jesus was an active agent in the creation persist?

The answer is that two creations have become confused in the minds of Bible readers. Jesus is indeed the mediator of the New Creation (Colossians 1:15-18). But he is not the creator of the universe. That creation is the work of the One God, the Father who acted alone when He stretched forth the heavens and the earth (Isaiah 44:24).

Unfortunately, one or two verses in the New Testament have been translated to give the impression that all things were made “by” Jesus. In fact the original states that all things were made “through” Jesus (see the margin of Colossians 1:16: “in him,” “through him” and “for him,” not “by him”).

Jesus was indeed the reason for God’s creation. The Father “foreknew” him from the beginning (1 Peter 1:20). In God’s great purpose Jesus was “slain from the foundation of the world” (Revelation 13:8). But he came into existence as the Son of God at his conception (Luke 1:35). There is no biblical text to support the idea that the Son of God was alive before his conception (though a few verses in John’s gospel have been used to support the idea).

When Jesus prayed to receive the glory which he had with the Father before the foundation of the world, he was asking for the glory which had been reserved for him and which he would receive after his resurrection (John 17:5). Peter speaks of an inheritance which is “reserved in heaven for you” (1 Peter 1:4). That inheritance is, of course, the earth which Jesus has promised to the meek (Matthew 5:5) and which he will give them when he returns to establish the Kingdom of God. The same glory which was planned for Jesus from the beginning had also been given already (John 17:22) to the disciples, even those not yet born! (John 17:20). This glory is a glory which all disciples “have” even though they have not yet received it. Similarly Jesus “had” glory laid up for him with the Father long before his birth. In John 17 he prays to receive it.

Isaiah 44:24 should settle forever the question about who created the universe, and Hebrews 1:10 should be read with careful attention to the fact that the writer says he is speaking there of the inhabited earth to come (i.e., of the future):

“God did not subject to angels the world to come of which we are speaking” (Hebrews 2:5).

There is no contradiction between the two Testaments on this issue. Jesus will indeed be instrumental in laying the foundations of the coming new heavens and earth (Isiah 51:16). But the original creation is the work of the One God, the Father, alone (Isaiah 44:24).

Preceding articles:

The very very beginning 1 Creating Gods

Genesis 1:26 God said “Let us make”

Additional reading:

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For once, AmChurchSpeak makes an important point: Lent is a journey to Calvary… (denvercatholic.org)
For two weeks, the Letter to the Hebrews draws on images from the Old Testament to introduce us to that “great high priest who has passed through the heavens, Jesus, the Son of God:” a mediator between God and humanity who “has been tempted as we are” and with whom we can “with confidence draw near to the throne of grace, that we may receive mercy and find grace to help in time of need” [Heb 4: 14-16]. Here, the biblical author writes, we find that “great cloud of witnesses” in whose company we are enabled to “run with perseverance the race that is set before us” [Heb 12: 1] Here is “Mt. Zion … the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem” to which we are brought through the mediation of Jesus, and where we join “innumerable angels in festive gathering” [Heb 12: 22].
The Liberation of the Triune God (derekzrishmawy.com)
One of the helpful emphases of the Reformed tradition is its acknowledgment of the continuity as well as discontinuity of Old and New Testaments. This comes through very strongly in Turretin’s Institutes and even makes an appearance in his doctrine of the Trinity. After a couple of clarifying questions, as well as a lengthy question devoted to proving the doctrine of the Trinity from New Testament Scripture, he moves on to try and demonstrate the revelation of the Trinity in the Old Testament. For while it is admittedly true that God reveals himself as Father, Son, and Holy Spirit with greater clarity in New Testament, that does not at all mean that we cannot see him revealed as such in the Old as well.
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There are a number of features worth noting in this treatment. The first is Turretin’s view of the Angel of the LORD, or the Angel of YHWH. As he makes clear in a number of places, Turretin views this as an appearance of the pre-incarnate Son. It is an appearance in angelic/human form that is, nonetheless, distinct from his incarnation in that there is no hypostatic union, but only concrete manifestation. Still, this is a thesis that Christian theologians have long appealed to in order to explain the way the Angel is both identified as a distinct agent who nonetheless is identified as the LORD somehow.
Learn From Christ (birdchirp.wordpress.com)
To prove that He was the Son of God by turning stones to bread was not necessary for Jesus or for Satan. Satan already knows all about Jesus Christ.
The Beauty of John’s Prologue (christianity201.wordpress.com)
The first 18 verses of John’s gospel (commonly known as the Prologue) represent a literary masterpiece of inspired Scripture. On the one hand, John’s introduction is so simple a child can understand it, yet it is also so theologically deep, the most intellectual scholars could never mine every detail held within its verses.

There have been many debates regarding the structure of John’s prologue. The most convincing in my opinion is that the first 18 verses are a narrative which summarize not only the entirety of John’s gospel but make a broad sweep of salvation history. The prologue begins in eternity before creation, declaring that in the beginning the Word already existed. It proceeds through the creation (all things were made by Him) and He is the source of all life and light. Then John skips over the majority of Israel’s salvation history and shows that a final prophet, John the Baptist, came to testify to the light. This light is the revelation of God Himself. He came into the world and was rejected by the world. Yet, those who received Him became the sons of God.

The prologue finishes by showing the culmination of Israel’s salvation in Jesus. The law (which was itself a grace given to men) came through Moses but grace and truth came through Jesus Christ. Jesus has completely explained the Father. Jesus is the Father’s final word to man. – This culminates salvation history. So, we see that the prologue begins in eternity past and concludes with God’s final word of salvation and redemption.
The Day Son of God Jesus Preaches (brentkuhlman.wordpress.com)
Now is the perfect time for Jesus to flex His Son of God muscles. Pull out all His divine Son of God stops. Unload the whole enchilada of His almighty Son of God power to break the bonds of systemic oppression, bust Locusts and Wild Honey out of jail, overthrow the wicked Roman oppressors and establish a Son of God millennial utopian reign that would make all community organizers of the world jealous!
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You’re in charge of your own life. You’re in full control. The master of your universe.

That’s precisely why Son of God Jesus preaches. With Him the promised and long awaited kingdom of God has come! God reigns on the earth in Jesus. God is at hand! It’s Messiah Time! And it’s perfectly obvious then that you need a preacher – Against Your Wishes! Against Your Desires! Against Your Idolatry! Otherwise, … well, let’s just say it will all end hellaciously for you. You’d be held captive eternally – kept under lock and key — in Satan’s gloomy prison!
Names, Titles, and Characters of Jesus Christ (goodnewsnow.wordpress.com)
The Blue Letter Bible has published a page with information taken from the whole Bible about the God we worship, Jesus Christ. Seeing all the names, titles and other attributes with which he is labeled in both the Old and New Testaments and contemplating those titles and their meaning to me personally is a wonderful way to worship Him. Worshiping Him is what we are made for. Worshiping Him is what those who know Him will do for all eternity. These Name, Titles and Attributes allow practice in this life.

The very very beginning 1 Creating Gods

February 21, 2015February 23, 2015Marcus Ampe45 Comments

Nothing, none, something or more present

For many people the beginning of everything is a very big mystery. Some think there was just emptiness or a void or that there was darkness and only Chaos. According to Greek mythology, the origin of everything, and the first thing that ever existed was Chaos. It was the primordial void, the source out of which everything was created, including the universe and the gods.

Plural form

For many there were gods who took care of everything coming into being. Also lots of Christians do believe that there were gods who created everything together. The biggest mistake those so called Christians make, is that they believe that there was a God the Father, a god the son and a God the Spirit who together created the universe and everything around. They do not understand that The Creator is, was and always shall be the Most High Being and as such has not only the title of god, like any high being, but also speaks in the plural form with the Pluralis Majestatis or Royal We.

Speakers employing the “royal we” use it to distinguish their private life with their function, or when they are directors, editors, writers, etc., they use it to avoid the personal I or to represent a collective viewpoint. A person in function, like the Creator, the Maker and makers of things, creators of pieces (artists, theatre and film directors, choreographers, etc.), directors (bosses or managers of institutions, universities, schools, factories, industrial or technological sites), leaders of a Courtney or group (kings, queens, presidents, führers, popes, cardinals, priests, pastors, youth-leaders, club-leaders, cheerleaders) will use the plural form when they speak as creator, artist, director or in function.

Gods and Big Bang

We may find people who believe in mythology where out of the void appeared Erebus, or an other god as the personification of the deep darkness and shadows and brother of Gae a (earth), Tartarus (underworld) a god, third in rank after Chaos and Gaea, preceding Eros (love), and Nyx (night).

There are a various amount of viewpoints on creation, but we want to stick to the one which is told by the Divine Creator Himself.
We, as Christians do believe in an eternal Creator divinity, and as such in a spiritual Supreme Being or eternal Spirit God, which had no beginning, has no birth and no ending, cannot die. That Supreme Being out of the darkness created “Light“. You might call it “Big Bang” or the “Supreme Light”, that does not matter so much, but important is that you can find yourself in accepting that from nothing something came into being and there came light.

All those who say that this or that was there or that the Big Bang was the first thing, should wonder how and out of what this big bang came into being. For sure they would say that “Before” the Big Bang there was Blackness, nothingness, something, void and should wonder what was the next thing “after” the Big Bang.

In the knowledge that “one day” for God is in the eyes of man a “thousand years” we can think of it that there have been a long period over this coming into being from one element into the next one, because on the second day of God sky or celestial dome was created. It was or is what we do know as the wideness which includes the atmosphere and outer space.

Coming into being

The “void” or “emptiness” and the “atmosphere” came into being because that One and Only One God Who declared to be the “One that is the One Who is the Being” (The “I Am the I am” or “The I Am Who Is”): I am that I am Ehyeh-Asher-Ehyeh אהיה אשר אהיה

3 Syllables Name: Je-Ho-Vah, by which the whole world should know God's Name — 3 Syllables Name: Je-Ho-Vah, by which the whole world should know God’s Name

He presented Himself with a tetragrammaton, a word with three syllables, which makes it unlikely the two syllable word Yahweh or Jahweh would be His preferred name. He said: “אני יהוה ani Ye-ho-vah.” This is the famous tetragrammaton, or name of three syllables and four letters, which we write Jehovah Yehovah, Yehveh, Yeveh, Jhuh, Javah, etc. The letters are Y H U H or YHWH. The religious Jews never pronounce it, and the true pronunciation is utterly unknown, but when you ask a Jew how they would pronounce it or speak yourself Hebrew you will find out that Jehovah is the right rendering of God’s Name of which God Himself says “That is my name – A name peculiar to myself.”

אני יהוה הוא שׁמי וכבודי לאחר לא־אתן ותהלתי לפסילים׃

“I am Jehovah, that is my name; and my glory will I not give to another, neither my praise unto graven images.” (Isaiah 42:8 ASV)

7 ስለዚህ የዕውሮችን ዐይን ታበራለህ፤ በጨለማው ጒድጓድ እስር ቤት ውስጥ ያሉትን እስረኞችን ታወጣለህ።

All people in the world should come to know the Name of God. He does find it important that His creatures should know Him by His Name and know that He only is the Most High ever. Probably shall find no other people called the same because God the Divine Creator said He is the only One with that Name, which may not be taken in vain.

‘That men may know that thou, whose name alone is JEHOVAH, Art the Most High over all the earth.” (Psalm 83:18 Lange)

Psa 83:17 (83:18) יבשׁו ויבהלו עדי־עד ויחפרו ויאבדו׃

“That they may know that {1} thou alone, whose name is Jehovah, Art the Most High over all the earth. {1) Or [thou, whose name alone is Jehovah, art etc]}” (Psalms 83:18 ASV)

Exo 20:7 לא תשׂא את־שׁם־יהוה אלהיך לשׁוא כי לא ינקה יהוה את אשׁר־ישׂא את־שׁמו לשׁוא׃

“Thou shalt not take the name of Jehovah thy God {1} in vain; for Jehovah will not hold him guiltless that taketh his name {1} in vain. {1) Or [for vanity] (or [falsehood])}” (Exodus 20:7 ASV)

Later He reminded Moses of His great name and that He is the covenant-making and covenant-keeping God, who will absolutely fulfil His promises (Exodus 6:2-5). The name denotes not Who is the eternal existence and that unchangeable truth and omnipotent Power which give fulfilment to His promises. It were as though He said, “I am Jehovah, for I am now to do what I have declared to be My purpose.” Compare, for further illustration of this name, Exodus 7:5 and Ezekiel 28:22.

Exo 6:2 וידבר אלהים אל־משׁה ויאמר אליו אני יהוה׃
Exo 6:3 וארא אל־אברהם אל־יצחק ואל־יעקב באל שׁדי ושׁמי יהוה לא נודעתי להם׃

“2 And God spake unto Moses, and said unto him, I am Jehovah: 3 and I appeared unto Abraham, unto Isaac, and unto Jacob, as {1} God Almighty; but {2} by my name Jehovah I was not {3} known to them. {1) Heb [El Shaddai] 2) Or [as to] 3) Or [made known]}” (Exodus 6:2-3 ASV)

Exo 7:5 וידעו מצרים כי־אני יהוה בנטתי את־ידי על־מצרים והוצאתי את־בני־ישׂראל מתוכם׃

“And the Egyptians shall know that I am Jehovah, when I stretch forth my hand upon Egypt, and bring out the children of Israel from among them.” (Exodus 7:5 ASV)

Eze 28:22 ואמרת כה אמר אדני יהוה הנני עליך צידון ונכבדתי בתוכך וידעו כי־אני יהוה בעשׂותי בה שׁפטים ונקדשׁתי

“and say, Thus saith the Lord Jehovah: Behold, I am against thee, O Sidon; and I will be glorified in the midst of thee; and they shall know that I am Jehovah, when I shall have executed judgments in her, and shall be sanctified in her.” (Ezekiel 28:22 ASV)

It was not at the creation that The Divine Creator would let His Divine name be known, but that does not mean it was not important not Him bringing everything to existence.

The world came to know Who had created everything and all people should be fully aware of that.

Jer 32:17 אהה אדני יהוה הנה אתה עשׂית את־השׁמים ואת־הארץ בכחך הגדול ובזרעך הנטויה לא־יפלא ממך כל־דבר׃

“Ah Lord Jehovah! behold, thou hast made the heavens and the earth by thy great power and by thine outstretched arm; there is nothing too {1} hard for thee, {1) Or [wonderful]}” (Jeremiah 32:17 ASV)

Already in the first book of Mozes (the Bereshith, the book of the Beginnings or Genesis) we are told that it where no gods but God alone Who created man in His image and how heaven and earth were created.

Gen 1:27 ויברא אלהים את־האדם בצלמו בצלם אלהים ברא אתו זכר ונקבה ברא אתם׃

“And God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.” (Genesis 1:27 ASV)

Gen 2:4 אלה תולדות השׁמים והארץ בהבראם ביום עשׂות יהוה אלהים ארץ ושׁמים׃

“These are the generations of the heavens and of the earth when they were created, in the day that Jehovah God made earth and heaven.” (Genesis 2:4 ASV)

Continues with:

The very very beginning 2 The Word and words

Readings from Scriptures: Genesis – Story of creation 1 Genesis 1:1-25 Creation of things

Readings from Scriptures: Story of creation 2 Genesis 1:26-31 Creation of man

Readings from Scriptures: Genesis – Story of creation 3 Genesis 2:1-15 Story of Adam and Eve

Readings from Scriptures: Genesis – Story of creation 4 Genesis 2:16-25 Warning for Adam and Eve

The very very beginning 3 Messiah’s total point of origination

Readings from Scriptures: Genesis – Story of creation 4 Genesis 3:1-13 The fall

Readings from Scriptures: Genesis – Story of creation 4 Genesis 3:14-24 consequneces of the fall and solution

Additional literature:

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A Call To My Greek Mythology Bloggers – which Greek God is this? (clairecatacouzinos.wordpress.com)
My only guess is that this statue is of the Greek God “Adonis” – Aphrodite’s lover, and the god of beauty and desire. Or perhaps, but not likely, the Greek Hero, Hyakinthos – Apollo’s lover who died by a discus.
‘Olympus’ Coming To Syfy Channel: Greek Action Drama Promises Battle Of The Gods [Video] (designntrend.com)
A new series about the life of mortals living among the many gods and monsters of Olympus is on its way to SyFy channel. The 13-episode mythology action drama began filming in August of 2014 in Vancouver. No specific release date has been set so far, but it’s slated to air in the spring of 2015.According to the Hollywood Reporter, the synopsis for the series centers on how a handful of brave men and women banished the gods to the realm of the Underworld, otherwise known as the Kingdom of Hades.
Re: Pantheon: (Dis)Grace of the Gods (bay12forums.com)
At the dawn of time, or perhaps, simply a beginning, since there were no sun to determine a “dawn” yet, there were 6 deities.These deities crafted a world over which to reside, and declared themselves to each be rulers of their own regions, that the others would not interfere in the others’ places.The three Gods of Domain were Althax, Lord of the Sky, Enthros, Lord of the Sea, and Darus, Lord of the Earth.The three Goddesses of Dominion were Enya, Lady of Creation, Ori, Lady of Destruction, and Juno, Lady of Balance.
Phoenix (mythology) (en.memory-alpha.org)
The Phoenix was a bird from Greek mythology that was known for being reborn as it arose from the flames of its predecessor.

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